This week we welcome our first guest to the show and do a deeper dive into net neutrality. We also discuss a number of new products being shown at CES, and our post-show turns into a tell-all.
We'll talk. I've got the paper over here too so I can kind of... You're gonna start like reading through the O-bits or something? Well, I do that here. What our listeners like the O-bit. I mean that would be kind of a fun thing, man. To honor some of those who have gone before us, you know. That wouldn't be such a bad idea for an episode. That's a Halloween special. A little Halloween special. We only do it once a year around the 31st. I think we could... I think they'd give us a little leeway to do that. People have been definitely been asking about it, so I mean I think it's something we need to bring to the audio. Alright, well I will grab the chronicle and we can poke around a little bit and see what's going on. [laughs] [Music] Oh shit, he just hit the start button folks Let the party begin here we are code Coffee and code cast episode X That's right episode X we got a big celebration today. We've reached our Xth episode kind of in true Like all the big guys do this Kyle Skip over nine and go right to ten we talked about this we actually talked about this on a couple of episodes Talked about earlier, I think one of the first episodes. Why is it that the Windows doesn't have a Windows 9? There's no iPhone 9 I'd look this up at one point in our show because we wanted to kind of find the solidified answer And most of them seem to be versions they want to hop to version 10 because they want to have some major Major milestone version, so they'll just be like they'll go from 8 to 10 or in our case we go from 8 to 10 as well because we have a major milestone that we're celebrating here, right? Damn straight. We got our first guest is on the show. Mr. Joseph Bully, a esteemed colleague, good friend, fellow software developer. I'm gonna let him introduce himself. Mr. Joseph Bully, welcome to the podcast. Hey, how's it going? My name is Joseph. I'm a software developer and I'm here. Just for the record, this is the second time we're done this because I fucked up, so it's my fault. Kyle forgot to hit the record button. I mean, it's all in the details. Yeah, I said some nice things about you guys. You're not gonna get that on me again. It took a lot to muster that up the first time, I understand. It's asking a lot. I can't inflate you guys' egos too much. Oh, he's taking a line out of my book. All right, Mr. Bully, I'm going to put you on the spot a little bit. I've got a new game that we want to play here. It's something that I want to introduce a little get to know you better. I'm calling it How I Dev, #HowIDev. And so I've got a few questions for you. Nothing, not too many curveballs, but just a little bit more about your Dev style, what you're up to. I have some questions. I think it would be interesting to know when we bring people on. even if you're not on the show, use this hashtag and let us know how you dev. And so I've got some questions like about your dev environment, your setup, your beverages of choice. It is a coffee codecast. We have to mention something about coffee or at least about beverages, favorite music, stuff like that. Hashtag got my dev. So yeah, well that bully started off and then you know, we'll let Kyle get in there. And I might do it. I don't know. We'll see. All right. Favorite music is the first thing, right? Yeah, like when you're in the zone, when you're in the Zen state of software development. Well, I listen to a lot of different things. Ranging topic, the Ranging afar variety of music. Right now I've been really digging in Odessa. Originally a local band, they started in Western Washington University. And they're kind of like chill, electronic music. They're actually coming to Seattle and March and I got tickets to see them so I'm pretty excited for that But then we're at the band. I've not did not realize they were from Western Washington. Yeah I have a lot of actually a lot of people I know are going to that. They're like pretty popular They released a new album a couple months ago. It's really good excellent. Okay, so does a Any other playlists or what do you do do Spotify? Oh, yeah Spotify premium Spotify premium. Okay, excellent. I do yeah, I listen to like electronic music and then I'll also listen to like a lot of Podcasts I like I'm I listen to the verge cast today. It's pretty good. Awesome. How about uh, I don't know leverages you coffee guy coffee tea water coffee in the morning Water for the rest of the day. Oh how many cups of one cup of coffee, double shot espresso made by our espresso machine. Oh, shout out to the revel Quar was a coffee machine. That thing is clutch. They get their good shit when I leave. See like when I was there, just like, diner coffee, you know, in the little foil bag that's been sitting there for nine months. Yeah. I remember one morning somebody was making espresso when I went in to go make mine. And I was like, I don't have time for this. And I go upstairs and have some of the coffee and I was like, It's terrible. On the topic of coffee, by the way, I want to big shout out to our buddy Simon, our big fan, fans in episode one, sent some beans over for the holidays over to the coffee code cast. Cracked into said beans this last week and I'm very impressed, very good stuff. It was the, I believe it was actually the Rwanda blend. I called it wrong the last time, but it was, it's a reserve blend. And it was my first time having reserve beans. And I enjoyed the hell out of it. It was great. I would do it again. Send a send about half of that bag my way away. Yeah, I can bring it up. I'll throw it in my bag. I'm making a trip out to Seattle tomorrow. I can bring some out there for you. There we go. Yeah, you're not a soda guy. I don't think I ever see you cracking a soda or anything like that. I allow myself one doctor pepper a week. I try and I figure since you're sitting in a desk all day, just like you're only moving your hands and it's not like an active as active as a lifestyle as I went in college. I need to compensate with my food choices. Probably a good, probably a good tip. Yeah, very interesting. One cup, a one cup coffee guy and a water the rest of the day. Very good. Very showing some good restraint here. That's just I'm impressed. Tell us a little bit about your office setup. Well, I have one of those big 4K monitors. It's pretty nice. I have a mechanical keyboard. We got a bunch of those one day at the office and I don't like my mouse level a lot. It's like a little wireless like Microsoft mouse. I think it's mostly for travel, but I use that as a desk thing. And the one thing I will recommend is the large mousepad. I think Kyle Got one of those after you saw mine. Is that like the wide one that covers the keyboard and the mouse? Yeah, I have one of those at home. My one at the office is like smaller. It's probably like a third of that, but it's super nice. Okay. You're recovered the old mechanical. Yeah, sweet. Anything else that you want to tell us about for your perfect zen state, do you do any kind of stretching or anything? Do you have a stand-up? No, you're a sit down guy. Sit down guy. I don't know if I would stand up. I am my way to get tired. I don't know. Now I think I'm good. Cool. We're really happy to have you here today, Joseph. I know we're going to at least have you on as a guest today. And who knows? Maybe have you back on other episodes if you're, if we don't scare you off too much. We'll see how this goes. We'll see how it's received. Yeah. Well, yeah, exactly. So for all of our listeners out there, let us know. Give us some feedback on Joseph Bowley. Give us the old Yeh or Nay. And also too, we want to get our, we want to get our listeners involved a little bit more. So play along with us on our little segment, How I Dev, #HowIDev. Let us know. What are your secrets? What are your, what is your Zen state look like? Music, beverages, coffee, tea, office set up, mechanical keyboard, whatever it is. Let us know what you use in your environment. I think one other thing to know too is, to Bully's point is that it's going to take a minute to figure out how it sounds or works or feels. We had a little snafu here earlier where we forgot to or I forgot to hit the record button and it was a little rough slog there for the beginning. And that's probably gonna happen just as we try and figure out how to work with three people instead of two. So there's gonna be bumps in the road or it's gonna change a little bit. So just gotta figure out how we wanna proceed and it's gonna feel uncomfortable for a while. I guess is what I'm trying to get at Monk's Story Short. Okay. Yeah, you know, that's just that's that's why we do things here. I mean we're we're all about change You know changes and always comfortable is it so you know we've done nine episodes We've made a few changes along the way so far, but I think this is good the reason why we wanted to bring Joseph on too other than just because Get that young youth perspective here You know we had that episode on net neutrality a few back and Joseph had some good feedback for us. I think I mentioned this already, but he has some good feedback for us and just challenged us on a few points and seemed to know a lot more about it even than we did. And so we said, you know, this is what we want to do. We want to have more of more diversity on the show in terms of opinions and experience. So we're looking for other points of view. We're looking for other topics that are interesting to bringing on the show and cover. So this is our first attempt at it. KJ, you get anything else for us? Or should we move it along? >> Let's move on to show notes. Do that real quick. We're going to have an update this week to the way the podcast is put out. In the previous weeks, we've been publishing with Pretty ridiculously high quality 256 Kilbits per second is what the bitrate was on the files that we were outputting which is what does that sound? Somebody have a baby. No, that's my cat. Oh shit sound like a kid Sorry, she's pretty vocal I can put her I can move her I thought bully with bully left a couple questions off of the how I deaf part there's a little get to know yet I didn't know about him I dab with a pack and play right next to my desk. [laughter] That's awesome. All right, now that you catch up the fuck up, where was I? I was talking about the quality of the show was really, really high. We were publishing it about 256 kilobits per second. Damn. There's a bit rate, which for us, who listen to it on some pretty decent speakers, and that sort of thing, especially you, Mike, I think, who has the whole DAC amp and all that kind of thing, it probably sounded really really great, but for the vast majority of people who listen to it on earbuds or whatever, there's no perceivable difference really. So we're going to cut that down by a pretty significant margin. I think we're going to start publishing at 64 kilobits per second, which will make the files something like a quarter or something like that. I mean, they'll be like 30 meg or something instead of 130. So just keep an eye out for that. If you notice anything, If it sounds like crap, let us know and we'll up it a little bit more, but hopefully that will save some space for people and for us as well on our hosting platform. Yeah, we're trying to find the right balance between quality and convenience and price and all of that kind of stuff. If we don't need to have it that large, we were hitting ceilings on our hosting cap pretty quickly with the number of podcasts we're doing right now. So if we don't need to have it that high and it can give us a little more wiggle room to post at our current rate, then I think that's a good thing. So we'll go to shot and see how it goes. The test for Undin seemed that bad. We did a little trial. We're on downsizing a few of the earlier shows, and I thought there was a very little difference, so I think we're okay. Yeah, for me, I couldn't hear anything, but I think you caught a few little artifacts, but you got a pretty nice setup. Yeah. Anyway, that's the deal. Let us know what you hear about that. topic is net neutrality, part two, with featuring Joseph Bowley. Yeah, that's right. We want to bring Bowley back in because he had a few good points when we were talking and after that last episode, after part one, we thought, "Well, hey, let's get him in here to set a straight. Why don't you set a straight? Give it, set the record straight." I'll try and tell you guys straight. So I actually thought you guys did a pretty good job at like doing like the surface issue of net neutrality and kind of like what happened in the news, but I've been researching it a lot and there's like a lot more that kind of goes into the policy here, the FCC changed and how it got to the way it was. So I'll start with a little bit of history. So the FCC is the Federal Communications Committee, right? And they regulate commission, yeah. And they regulate a large swath of telecommunication industries and they're all classified under different titles. So, the internet can be classified under one of two titles, title one and title two. Title one makes them an information service, and title two is more like of a utility service. Basically, historically, internet has been regulated under title one for a long time, but we've always had net neutrality rules. Verizon won like a pretty crucial court case a while back that basically said you can't enforce net neutrality rules under a title one classification. So they were moved to a title two classification which makes them a utility and other things that are regulated like this are electric electricity companies telephone lines and things like water are regulated like this. And when was that done that was done in the Obama administration right like sometime in No matter what time when was that that was like like 2010 maybe I think the core case took a number of years Verizon suit against the FCC took a number of years and Then after they won that lawsuit a couple months later Like within half of a year. I'm pretty sure they were moved to a title to classification and the net neutrality rules were reinstated That was decided in January 14th 2014. Oh, okay It wasn't around very long in title two when they wanted to get rid of it, right? I mean there was I think the first push to repeal net neutrality would have been about three years ago Yeah, it's it's been going on for a while, but it hasn't really caught any traction until the a GPI the new head of the FCC was appointed and Title 2 is kind of special too because it basically regulates these markets like a monopoly. So a lot of people think Internet service providers are a monopolistic industry because it's expensive to lay down lines and you only really have one or maybe two choices of Internet service provider if you're lucky. And so like electricity companies are a great example. They're regulated kind of like this. And they are electricity companies are regulated more heavily than internet service provider companies. So like, under title two, if the government really wanted to, they could regulate exactly what pricing schemes, Comcast, or Time Warner could sell internet to people. But they haven't done that. So yeah, any questions? I'm afraid for that portion. No, no, I'm following along. Yeah, this is good, some good additional clarity on it. makes sense, and that was one of the things that we talked about last time too. It makes sense that it would be treated as utility. I think that for a lot of reasons, right? Infrastructure costs being one of them and because of the limited options. - And not only that, but I think we alluded to it. Everybody needs it. It's, you can't, I don't know how people get along these days without internet, right? Everything requires internet, whether it's a job or signing up for another utility, right? You need the internet to do these things generally speaking. So it needs to be treated as such. Yeah, and there's some element of that. We didn't really get into it, but you can, there is some level of access at the community level. I know that libraries have terminals that you can access and they're free, right? Like your taxes pay for that. You can go in and use a machine with your library card or even rent a laptop. Those things do exist, but, you know, this, this is a bigger issue of just making it fair and accessible to the masses, right? - And so there are arguments that people have made for moving internet server providers back under a Title I regulation. And so I was gonna go over a couple of those. One was the regulation of pricing schemes. The FCC could tell column cast and time warner and AT&T and Verizon basically exactly what they can price internet at. And there's not a whole lot of support for that and they haven't done that which could be a good or bad thing But there's not a lot of support for that from who from the The ISP companies definitely don't want the government to tell them what they can't and can't sell Internet rates at I guess and Because they make less money and I don't think there has been a lot of support for that from the public either Like you haven't it's mostly been a fight for net neutrality and then It's I feel like the public is kind of backed off at that point like that's that's the line we want to draw and When I don't know under under title two it could be that we say Internet should be should be priced less and you have to sell these certain packages to consumers to make it more accessible for everyone So the public cares less about pricing than they do about the freedom free flowing information or or like Mike said the that their packets aren't being downgraded in any way. Yes, that's what I would say. Because you don't really see a fight for regulating pricing schemes of internet companies. You don't really see local governments and state governments trying to regulate those companies more. It was always just like, no, treat all information equal. There's also the argument that by squeezing unusual use cases, service can get better for the average users. So what that means is like if you have like a one terabyte data cap, we have a one terabyte data cap that Comcast imposes upon residential internet. If you, most people aren't going to go over that cap. So by charging an unusual use case, like a person who downloads more than a terabyte a month of data, you can make service, you can make the market more profitable and build out better service for everybody else who doesn't go over that cap. example of my guy that was a streamer his HBO to 30,000 of his best buddies. Yeah, there you go. So it makes the market more profitable, is the main takeaway there. And another thing is that some people don't think that internet service providers have them, then, we all miss market. So deregulating the market will allow other competitors come into the market and maybe you'll get more options for internet and maybe it'll become more competitive and you won't just see people just having access to concaps in an area. I think that's an interesting argument only because the lines tend to be owned by about two companies in the United States, generally speaking. Unless they're going to get into the business of some sort of really wide broadcast wireless, or satellite, I guess, it's going to be incredibly expensive. for somebody to get into the market even in a small way. So some people don't think that there's a very high cost to getting into the market that way, but a lot of people think there is and there is an argument to be had there. And I think those are the three main arguments I made for moving Internet service providers back to under Title I regulation. I also have a section for arguments for rating ISPs under Title II. So a big issue here is that Comcast is, for example, is being coming vertically integrated with content providers. So Comcast is a majority investor in BuzzFeed and I think they own NBC Universal. I believe you're right. Yeah, so what they could potentially do is they could, if they're not treating all traffic to and from your computer equally, they could throttle competitors and give a boost to their content. And this has happened before. I think it was Verizon was throttling Skype data and promoting FaceTime data. I was going to say this is one of the big arguments that you see whenever you hear Net Neutrality, this is like one of two topics that's kind of like the big buzz, buzz worthy items that you hear is that yeah, the bigger companies like Comcast are going to start to give priority to their content and their traffic and downgrade everybody else's content. So that's one of the very large arguments that you hear whenever this comes up. Yeah, and you don't really have a choice. Like you can't say, oh, I can either choose from the Clawmcast package or I can choose from the Time Warner/Disney package. You know, like whatever is in your city is what you're going to get. So it's kind of shitty for the consumer. And basically, there's also an argument for deregulation. That's a big thing in, I feel like a lot of American society is like, get the government out of business, like, deregulate the market so that it becomes more profitable. And my response to that is that you're not really deregulating the market because you're taking away government regulation and you're allowing the company to regulate what you can and can't do. isn't going away, it's just being delegated to the company at that point, to the ISP. That would be my argument there. And I can clarify on that, your deregulating one market, but the cost is going to come from a different market. So say you have a mob and pop shop that is trying to compete with a concast owned in a content provider. Most people are going to go to whichever website has the better service. If the Mom and Pop shop is getting throttled heavily, then they're going to have a harder time entering into that market and competing with the ConeCast shop. Right. I think Mike alluded to this in the other episode where he was kind of comparing YouTube versus coffee codecast to YouTube's gonna have a dramatic advantage and be able to create business partnerships with whatever large company, whereas a little startup like coffee codecast videos or whatever it is is not gonna be able to make a splash in the market because they're gonna not have the deals worked out with the major companies. So I think while you're making, you might be making the internet service provider market more profitable, it's at the cost of the profitability of other markets. And it's my argument that the open internet promotes business opportunities and innovation in those markets and the profitability in those sectors is going to outweigh the cost of net neutrality regulation on the ISPs. There's also the fact that if you're arguing for more profitability in the internet service provider market, there's also been conflicts of interest in the past because Comcast is actively lobbied against municipal internet services in towns across the US. Fort Collins is a great example right now. are trying to pass a bill to get municipal internet service. And there's a bunch of ads floating around or down there that are basically paid for by Conquest. And I can send you guys a link to those, actually, after if you want to include that. I guess that's the crux of my argument right there. That's basically what I came to say. There's other issues. So not only are you saying they can effectively stifle other competitors by throttling them, but they're actively marketing against them in this case as well. - Yeah, so they're not only are they using their infrastructure to throttle competitors, they're also using the money that they're making off of their infrastructure to advertise against competitors and make it harder for people to enter the market anyways. And so that's why it's kind of counterintuitive because on one hand, they're arguing that derigulating ISPs will make the market more profitable and then promote investment into that market. But then they're also fighting against competitors. Oh yeah, another thing was like a lot of, a large amount of money went into lobbying for this ruling from those companies. I cited an example where Verizon and AT&T both spent over a quarter of a billion dollars each lobbying to make this change. And so I feel like that's like anti-consumer as well. Clearly a huge motivation for them to spend that kind of dollar. Yeah. Another couple other points that I was making was like, Internet service providers currently have the lowest satisfaction rating across all industries, surveyed by the American customer satisfaction index. with an approval rating of 64%. - No surprise there. I don't think anybody's surprised by that. - Well, and that's why I have a problem with the way that repeal was written because it says really more less like to paraphrase like kind of in a good faith effort. You know, the ISPs are gonna enforce these things as they see fit, right? Like I don't remember the exact language I have to look it up again, but it was, It was when you're talking about something with that kind of 64% approval rating, you know, if 40% of the people don't approve or not satisfied with the options or with the services being provided, I don't have a lot of confidence. If that's happening with net neutrality in place, then I don't have confidence that those scores are going to go up. They're going to go down even further, given control to the ice piece. There's also a lot of like outcry like against the neutrality repeal coming out and it was kind of ignored by the people in charge. Yeah, you saw on websites all over the all over the world basically gigantic banners and ads and different things that people were putting up to bring attention to this issue. I mean, it was crazy. Like I remember looking at Reddit on the day, I think it was a couple days or the week before and every every subreddit had a had a topic that was on the first page with with just like a link to one particular site that talked about this thing that had, you know, linked on how to contact your representative or numbers to call, etc., etc. So yeah, there was a crazy outcry, but it was totally just ignored. Yeah, it was kind of crazy how, and there was also the issue with like people were finding on the comments on the bill, on FCC.gov, people were finding like dead relatives had commented in favor of the repeal. And so, you know, you could say whatever you want about that. I don't, nobody ever found out who exactly did that, but there was somebody with a vested interest promoting a certain viewpoint. - Interesting. - Yeah, I didn't hear that. - Fascinating, bully, fascinating. I have a personal thoughts section if you guys wanted to do personal thoughts. Well, my personal thoughts are that, I think internet should be regulated just like a utility, you know, instead of going the direction we're going or staying the direction, staying where we were like a year ago, I think it's feasible that we could go further and actually regulate internet like a utility, it's just like electricity, roads and water because I feel like everybody benefits from its equal use and it's a lot like those markets. It's very hard to lay down infrastructure. Everybody, business benefits from the internet, benefit from the internet and I feel like even though it is considered a luxury now, eventually it will be as integral to life and modern society as electricity roads and water. Well it's already that way in my book education right, education's a fundamental piece and the internet delivers that textbooks courses video. I don't know I don't know how you grow up without the internet and education K through 12 education today. Homeworks online, right? I mean, I don't know. All the systems that are out there anymore, but I know that even when I was, because I came up later on, we used computers, but we didn't have the internet fully when I started going to school until later on. But by the time I was in college, that was the only way to turn in assignments for certain things. I was the only way to really communicate with professors. So, clear to me, it's become something that's really ubiquitous. It's something that it's used. It's just like a road. And I can imagine not being able to get from one end to town to the other. Like people need to travel, people need to get to work or do whatever it is they need to do using physical infrastructure. And to me, the internet's no different in a virtual space. I know Christina's niece and nephews are still in school. even beyond homework, even things like school announcements, you know, no school today or whatever, you know, that there's an emergency on the campus or whatever it may be. Those are all broadcast via email or via the website or other electronic medium. There's not really any other way to get that information. So, again, to your point, I don't know how you get along today without internet. - Yeah, my mom is even a kindergarten teacher and uses online resources to teach students now, you know? know, at her school, I'm pretty sure that all the students have iPads that they bring home, get homework assignments, do lessons on, and it's really, it's been really beneficial as she said. And so I can't imagine like, you roll this back and you're moving back like five, ten years in terms of just educating children. Yeah. Yeah, that's a good example. Why it needs to be a utility, why it needs to be regulated. If you have people that want to abuse the hell out of it, you just charge them. Commiserate what the use is right. Like then now you're going to have a big bill. If you want to run the heat and have 120 degree house, you can 100 degrees. That's what you like to do. You're going to have a thousand dollar bill. Yeah, that gets back to the whole fairness thing, right? It's kind of fair, fair play to everybody. So pay for what you're using. Yeah. Well good. That's helpful. It's helpful to make that distinction between Title I and Title II. that was a more of a mucky area for me that I hadn't explored as in depth. So appreciate that. And just the other insights you had on that. So that's great. Thank you. Yeah, I feel like a lot of the focus was on like the surface issue of equal rights for content, long lines, but not a whole lot of articles or points of view that I was reading them to really got into how we went from 10, 20 years ago to where we are now and like the history of it and the legality and why both sides of the argument and why I think the way I do, I guess. Well, I'm a note one more piece before we before we move on, I want to talk about is just the future of the of the issue because even though there was a repeal, this is far from over. There's been a lot going on in the news in the last week or so, a couple weeks. Big tech getting involved, state government now is getting involved joining the fight to protect net neutrality. I know in my new state of California that one of our senators had released some legislation, Proposal legislation this week to enforce the neutrality at the state level. There's also the Congressional Review Act that's being being used. Yes. Yeah, there are a few pieces that are out right now. this is where I'm going to get a little iffy. This particular piece I'm talking about is Senate Bill, 822, Senator Weiner in California, San Francisco, promoted doing legislation stating that the legislatures intend to effectuate net neutrality in California utilizing the state's regulatory powers. I read about that. The things I read about it were that it doesn't seem like it seems like the states could pass laws like that, but the FCC's authority might override the state governments. Yeah, that's what I had read too, is that these were all pretty flimsy and really wouldn't stand up even if they did pass, and they're just kind of feel good legislation. It's more of like a, I think it's more of like a point that they're trying to make rather than something that's actually going to work, which is fair. Yeah, we'll see. I mean, this is a broader issue, but the same sort of thing is already happening with federal versus state legislation of marijuana, for example. So I know that Trump now is trying to put other restrictions in place to tell the feds to ignore what's going on at the state level. I think it's his attorney general, not necessarily him, but well, he's pushing for it. There's a point of view that he might be trying to put the squeeze on his attorney general that promised he wasn't going to touch state regulation on marijuana is going back and trying to touch state regulation on marijuana. Yeah, very interesting. So anyway, there's that outlet. There's a lot of things going on too. There's a lawsuit against the FCC from, I think there's some big tech in there, big tech Etsy, and who else is in there now? There's a few other stuff. Yeah, I heard a number of companies, but I can't recall the names right off the top of my head. I thought Apple was one of them. Well, there was some of those, some of the big dudes, some of the FANG, that's what they call them now, FANG. If you're familiar with that. - No. - Facebook, Amazon, Netflix, Google. - Wow, Netflix is in the top four there, huh? - Netflix is very profitable. Netflix is in like the top, I wanna say 15, most profitable companies, even when they were back doing DVD business, they were profitable. Yeah, it's kind of crazy. I wouldn't have counted them among that kind of profitability because when you think of Google, you think of like given Google's much more profitable than Netflix probably, but I wouldn't have ranked Netflix among them. - Yep. - No, I wouldn't either. That was surprising to hear that they would be in the same leagues as those other companies. - Yeah, so Etsy's filing a lawsuit. I thought they did file it already or they're in the process of arguing that their seller community is directly impacted by the order urging the FCC to adopt strong neutrality rules and they're getting some other giants Facebook and Google aren't gonna sue on their own, they can't technically because didn't file comments when the FCC was debating the repeal, so they're not eligible to petition but they're joining, a lot of the big brands in Silicon Valley are joining, striking through lobbying organizations, backing up at C. And even there's another component to it as well with it being midterm lesions this year. They are trying to just get a massive rally from the younger generation, you know, from the millennials who are not happy about it overall to hopefully turn over some seats. So if it doesn't, if it's not immediately overturned or reinstated how however you want to say it through the lawsuit. Then there's other means too, right? Like let's just turn over some of those. I think in the Senate right now, it's a two person. It's a majority of two on the Republican side. And in the House, I think there's 24 seats are needed to turn it over. So you're trying a couple different angles to this is going to be an issue that's going to be going on for a while. Yeah. Yeah, I think that is exactly right. I think this will be kind of a back and forth issue, kind of like a lot of them are as soon as another president sits down at the table. This is going to be one of the things that they're going to want to turn over right away. It's going to be one of the first items of execution. So yeah, I think there'll be a whole lot more that we'll hear about this over the coming weeks, days, months, and years. And I think that was a very good roll-up. I think that was a good deep dive. I think that's a lot more information than I knew about it or wanted to know about it. (laughs) Oh man. Now it's fine, it was good. I was just kidding. Big Chipper, you gotta head out here shortly, right? - What I'd like to do, we don't have a whole lot to talk about, a whole lot else to cover here, but it's exciting. I wanna bring up some of the stuff that's happening at CES already, even though it's just, it just started today is the first official day of the consumer electronics show in Vegas. There's already been some really cool products that have been announced and things coming out. So why don't we talk a little CES? - Yeah, so you said it just started today. So there's been a ton of, I've seen a ton of these items pop up and I didn't know, I assumed that the show had already started because I've seen a lot of these items that you've got listed here. So how are these, are these getting like previewed on the floor or why are these already, you know, why are they already known about? - Well, this is interesting to me. It's a good point because the XPS 13 is a good example of this, right? They were gonna wait until CES the release details and pricing of the machine. They did a sneak peek back in late fall, early winter of this late fall of the changes, but they were gonna hold out until the show. Well, they did a little bit of an about phase on that and they announced the pricing before the show even started. So technically people started showing up last week. There was some press events and some other things going on starting Sunday. So Sunday night, Sunday afternoon, Sunday evening, but then Monday, Tuesday, I believe, or just Monday was a press event as well. And I don't think it was open to the general public. So I think today was the first day that it was generally open to the public. - So the first item you have on here is the, oh, this is different actually. I didn't, I guess I forgot that these were different items. The first one is the LG rollable OLED TV, which... - Yeah, have you seen this? This is pretty bad, actually. - It's just a short article about it where they kind of showed it. Yeah, kind of in like a, almost like you'd think of a rolled up newspaper, right? - Exactly. It looks like it's not housing that was kind of like, the way I thought of it, it was kind of like a housing that you'd have for a projector, like when those motorized projectors, except it's not hanging from the ceiling, it's just sitting on a table. And then yeah, it kind of rolls out. It's a 65-inch that they had on display. And really very neat look and full K resolution, rollable 18 inch display panel. Didn't look any different than other OLED TVs from people that were there checking it out. They know how much it's gonna cost. It looks pretty cool. There's no pricing on it yet. Yeah, no pricing or availability yet. This is just a sneak peek. A lot of these things are previewed, like they're not even ready for production. They just kind of are showing like the coolest shit they have available that they've built, but they don't even have it ready to be like ramped up or anything like that. Come on, I think the same goes for the next one. That's on the list there, the Samsung, the wall, which this one actually is the one that I was thinking of when I first looked at that other item. This thing, this thing is pretty cool. So it's A, it's huge, and B, it's modular as I understand it, so you can effectively have almost as big of a display as you want, is that right? So you can kind of have multiple, I don't know how to describe it, multiple panels. - That's right, yeah. These are massive panels, by the way. 146 inch panels, but yeah, you can, you can, I don't even know what you call it, chain them, stack them. - Yeah, chaining would be a good way to describe it, I guess. - Yeah, yeah. - Have very limited scene. You can't really perceive the scene very easily. At least I think they said, as long as it's running, you could maybe if it's not running. Yeah, so it's huge. There's the baby again. Sorry. She really does sound like a baby. She's such a talker. I don't have a child, by the way. We went over this when we weren't recording, I think. You're so young, Molly. I was just so surprised. I didn't know that about yourself. I have a cat. - Yeah, you can basically put the Samsung wall television in theory, you could plaster an entire wall with these panels and have a TV the size of your wall without using like a projector or something like that. - That's right, that's right. Yeah, and they say that because of the scaling of it or the stacking, the chaining of it, that the resolution isn't predetermined either, so you can increase the resolution as well. - Well, and I think the other major thing here that is of note is that there's no backlight on it is what I was reading. So each LED has its actual own light, which is supposed to make all the colors be pretty amazing and the blacks be true black and those sorts of things that make a really, really quality display picture. - Nice. - And that's apparently a pretty new technology or hasn't been done before with it. And I was reading that and that sounded pretty cool as well. - Awesome stuff coming out on the TV front. There's always new TV stuff, but I've been waiting for the rollable LED and this stackable things kind of neat too. I don't know how I could stack it unless I had an auditorium in my home, but I still like it. It's still cool shit. You could fill a wall in your place, I'm sure. You could just have your whole bedroom wall would be like your computer screen. I mean, that'd be pretty bad. It'd be like that scene from the Forfendetta when that guy's like taking a shower and then there's a big giant TV screen like behind him. I think that's that movie. And you just have like a whole wall as a TV screen you could be an evil Mastermind yeah exactly throw away that damn curved screen that you got now you have a whole wall. Hey I just got the curved screen it's only a couple weeks old. It's old it's all the news, too Well, it actually is old news because LG did come out with a couple new They have a new 5k curved that they I knew it was coming out but I didn't care because it was out of my price range anyway and this is pretty damn nice. Can't always have the best stuff. That's the one bad thing about tech is like as soon as you get your new cool gadget. Yeah and something something even newer and cooler comes out. It always has it's inevitable. What can you do? It has to be cool enough for me. I did get ahead on the XPS 13. It's gonna be a little while before before something else comes out there to top that. Yeah, I mean, how long did the current iteration of that stick around? I was several years at least, right? Yeah, the design has been around for three years, so it didn't change. Yeah. So aside from maybe a spec boost and processor and maybe a little more RAM, you probably aren't going to get a whole lot of difference, say? That's right. Yeah, that's right. Not much different there. And 4K, I don't know how long. I don't know that I'll need more than 4K resolution in the next few years on my 13-inch display. Yeah, I'll be interested to see how these higher resolution monitors continue to move forward. At some point, we're going to hit a wall where nobody's going to care anymore. I don't know where that is, but it's going to happen eventually. Yeah, it could just change, too, because there was a thing with processors forever, right? Where it was all about how many gigahertz, and so everything was based on, Before Intel changed it up, you had Pentium, 386.46 Pentium, and shit like that. But then you also had processor speed. It was always like, "Oh, yeah, the 2.1 GHz model." You don't see that anymore. It's not easy to find. You might want to slow down and go back a few years, Bowie here. You just lost him. Speaking of processors, did you guys hear about the... Basically, it's a branching and predictive processing hack that was released. I think it was meltdown inspector. Oh boy. That's a big topic for another show. Yeah, I would love for you to lead the charge on this. There's so much coming out about it right now. I read the first portions of the Google papers about those. Basically, the only thing I'll say now is that it's not just Intel that might be affected. Yeah, I want you to explain that and give me the short version of this because I want to get into it deeper next time so I don't give too much away. But what's going on there? It threw me for a loop because it started out being an Intel issue and then I recognized that Apple said, "Oh, all of our phones are affected." So, got me wondering, do you know does Intel make the A9 chip and the A series chips So this is technology that's been out for years and years. Basically, I don't know the exact term for it, but I'm going to call it predictive processing and branching. The idea that your processor, you don't want to get caught into a walking mode. So if one of your processes depends upon another process to finish, say you're executing one function executing one function and while that function's running, you don't have enough data to execute your other function. Your processor will actually go forward and say, well, if I'm stuck in this loop, and I've been doing the same thing for a long time, so I'm gonna keep on executing ahead forward in this loop. And even though I don't have, I can't go to this other step or I'm waiting for something else, I'm going to do what I can, while I can, while I'm waiting for other data to come back to me. And then when that data's ready, I'll finish the task and move on to the next thing. And so basically your processor will predict what it needs to do next before it needs to do it. And some of that gets into restricted memory locations, like kernel memory. And if you, and I'm really reaching, 'cause I don't know a whole lot about it right now, But basically if you can think of it as like, think of it as like, I heard this on a different podcast. Think of it like you're gonna rob a bank. So you go up to the bank wall and you try and get in the door and the door's locked so you can't get in. In an alternate reality, your self would go up to the door. The door wouldn't be locked. You would open it, go inside and find Kyle's Netflix password on the ground. And then the other you that got stuck outside the door is listening in on that other reality you that found the password. And that guy whispers the password and you now know Kyle's netflix password. Holy shit, I feel like I just took a trip to the matrix there. KJ. Yeah. I hope I can give a better explanation in the future. No, - Well, this is cool. I would love to hear more about it. I think we should bring that one. Let's just make that a little bit of the teaser here for next time, is that we're gonna get in a little bit more of this. It's been all over the place the last couple of weeks. These stories be breaking, call those spectre. Was there a meltdown and spectre, right? Are the two issues right now? - Yeah, and it's basically an exploit for an advancement in computing that's been around for 10, 20 years. And so if we stop doing the things that are exploitable, then we're going back a long ways in computing power. - Yeah. Here I found it. It says explaining meltdown to non-technical spouse. And then it says, "In quotes, you know how we finish each other sandwiches?" - Which sandwiches. - Sandwiches, yeah. No sentences, but you guys sandwiches. in your mind for it was in your mind for an instant and it was a password and someone stole it while it was sitting there fleeting and then they respond oh that is bad. Yeah. So that's kind of a pretty basic way to describe it. Interesting. Yeah, I can't say fully understand it yet, but I like to get into a little bit more. I'll read the Google papers and report back. That'd be a good one for our next one for number 11. So I'll jump back up briefly. I'll try to get through this really briefly, but just some of the new announcements out of CES. So we talked about the TVs and the rollable OLED and the Samsung wall. And there is one item that I'm super excited about, which is this concept from Foldy Mate. You guys have heard of FoldyMate.com. Has a new product coming out. It's a prototype at CES. It's the ultimate. It's not going to iron your shirt bitch for your KJ. Damn it, quite that. Not quite that sophisticated. - So I can't throw away the iron yet. - You can't throw away the iron, but you can have it fold the shirt. - Fold my shirt. - Sudo. - Fold my shirt. (laughing) - I don't know if it has a Alexa integration yet either. But this is a pretty cool piece of tech right here. I watched the video and it's impressive. - I was watching the video as well. Yeah, I think it's a pretty interesting piece of technology. It's very large. Yeah, it looks like an old library printer maybe size, I don't know, it's a floor standing unit, right? Maybe more accurately, the describe is like a dorm fridge or something. Oh, it's like a printer. Yeah, it looks like a printer. That's why I was thinking like a library printer thing, but it's floor standing. I don't know the dimensions on it exactly. It's probably three, four feet tall. I don't know if it would fit under a counter or not. and countertop heights, like 36 or 42 inches in that range. So this is gonna be somewhere in the ballpark of that. - I wanna see a demo. - It seems like you have to unfold your shirts and feed them in there flat anyways. You can't just throw shit in the hamper and it comes out folded, like that's what I want. - Yeah, this is not a, you're just gonna take your whole basket of laundry, dump it into some box and it's all gonna come out folded beautifully. That's not how this works. Unfortunately. - That's what I am. These damn millennials always trying to raise the bar, always trying to knock shit down. This is fucking cool. I mean, back in the day. Dude, I have to do half the work anyways. I have to like, like, have the work. Yeah, you gotta like, take it out of the basket and like, oh, make sure it's in right side in and like, feed it in. It's like, it feels like a vending machine, you know? Like, you put the dollar in and then it's gonna go like, "Bam, bam, bam, like, feed it back out to you." I'm not a bully on this. I think it's, I think it, I mean, you're saving yourself a little bit of work, but I think, I don't know, you're not, you're still having to sit there and manage it manually. I don't know. Yeah, and then what if it takes like, I don't know, like, you fold your, you fold your own clothes, like probably five seconds each? What if it takes like a couple extra seconds each to like, fold the clothes? It's almost more efficient for me to like, instead of standing there feeding a clothes the whole time for me to just fold it myself. Sell it on a mic. Sell it on it. Folding clothes sucks shit. It's the worst part about the whole thing. So, well, that's your real issue is that you don't fold the, that's why, see, I understand now. It's creating more work for you because it's a step that you already don't have in your, in your workflow. But dammit, for the rest of us who like, don't like wrinkles in our shit, I'm telling you, you go to the dryer and you gotta get the shit out of there anyway. So you take it out the dryer, usually what? Throw it on the bed and then you gotta get the hangers, if you're gonna hang it up, something's hanging, something's gotta fold them up so I gotta lay it down and crease it over and make sure that it's, I don't want to put the crease in the wrong place. No, no, no, like with this you just take the shit out of the dryer, you can still throw it on the bed if that's what you want to do. And then you just take one item at a time and you feed it into the feeder. And next thing you know, when you're done feeding off your articles of clothing and your towels. It's not just shirts, button up shirts, t-shirts, jeans, towels. Oh, towels, yeah. Socks, you throw them all in there and on shirts. You name it, throw it in there and you open the bin at the bottom and you got a nice stack and neatly folded close. I thought I read that it wasn't able to fold quite a number of things. Oh, maybe I was wrong. Maybe not socks. Any type of shirt, or pants. Oh, if you're fatty, it won't handle you. It'll only do, it'll only do age five to adult size double XL. So, you know, if you're rocking the triple or the quad XL, then... Or if you're five years old, four years old? You're gonna also fold standard size towels, pillowcases that says so. Pretty much everything. Yeah, look at that. Pretty much everything. That's impressive. Yeah, I'll be honest, it was cool. It's a very cool technology. I think it'd be even more, it'd be made better if it was able to do exactly what Joseph says. I'm of the same onset because I don't, I'm already, I feel like the only thing that this is doing is it's folding it maybe in a consistent manner whereas as a human you're not going to, the steps to folding are the same. I mean, you still have to feed it in there whereas like Joseph said, you know, I could just sit there and fold it myself and be done in about the same time as I have to feed it into this machine. So to To me, there's not a ton of value there aside from you're gonna get the same type of fold every time. And to me, that's, I don't know, not worth a thousand bucks, I guess. - Well, I don't know. I'm gonna hold my thoughts out until I see this thing in the real world here. I think the initial impressions are positive. I like a consistent fold. I want to be done the same way every time. I don't want it to get wrinkly 'cause doing it myself just isn't an imperfect thing. And I hate doing it. So for me, I have a little space next to the stackable washer and dryer. I can have that thing up against the wall over there and open the door on the dryer, feed a few items of clothing and some shit in there, have a nice day. Well, I'll send you my baskets of laundry and you can fold them through your machine. I'll charge you a bucket item. I give me a thousand items. It pays for my unit. You get my spilted shit. I think everybody wins. Hey, you got a service spring and upright in front of you. I think I'm gonna do it. There was a guy that did that with photo scanning, you know? Well, there was a little blurb about him because he was doing batch processing of photos, convert your print photos into digital. And was it Epson came out with a high speed scanner? It'll do some ridiculous amounts. It's like a thousand bucks. It's the same idea. It's a thousand bucks or something like, maybe it's not that much. Several hundred dollars, five hundred to a grand. But this thing will do five hundred photos an hour. something stupid like that. And so they were trying to knock him out at the kneecaps, and so they were advertising, they're doing Google AdWords and stuff on his search terms, so that they would just buy the high-speed printer and send a sending them off to this guy. Yeah, that's the good folks over at Fuldymate.com. @FuldMate is their Twitter, but I thought that was neat. I thought it was pretty cool. There's a lot of stuff at CES that's way farther out there, I think. Like the luggage that drives itself and then crashes into shit. Did you see that? - No, but I did see that the FAA was banning that sort of luggage. - Well, that's another problem. Any of those, particularly if it has batteries, lithium ion, that sort of thing, a lot of the airlines aren't gonna allow that shit to be checked in or on the airplane. So I don't even know if you'll be able to carry some of that stuff on. Gonna be careful before you go spend a bunch of money on that. - I think to be fair on this whole laundry folding thing, I think to give it all fairness, it's a cool technology and I think it could be further pushed forward and do some very, very cool things. I think right now, yes, it does have a value, but for me, it's not high enough to justify the cost of it, but I think in future iterations, I might be very interested in the product. So yeah, that's where I'm at. I'm not gonna go spend 1000 bucks. By the way, you can't even if you want to. It's not gonna ship until the end of next year, 2019, Q4. So you're gonna wait, and then maybe by then, who knows, the price of folding laundry I might go down a few hundred bucks. We'll have robots that'll do that shit for us. Or you can do it for the low, low price of free. - You mean not doing it? - Yeah, basically. I hanged from the day. - Not dead. - I don't even fold them. - Well, I would fold more if I had a folding machine. How about that? - I guess. I guess that's one way of looking at it. - I would have a dresser and I would fold shit and put it in the dresser. - Yeah, this thing was doing all kinds of crazy shit, taking people out at CES. I don't even know what was happening, but it was, this is a robotic luggage. - Okay. - Had a little mind of its own. - Is it supposed to fall out? Like I didn't get to read the article 'cause of the fucking audio, but is it basically just following like some sort of wrist band or something that you hold so it knows where to go or what's the deal? - Yeah, I guess. I have no idea. This is just, this isn't the deep dive, dammit Kyle. This is just the high level. Just, here's some interesting shit at CES, kind of the thing going on. - Oh yeah, wrist band, yeah, you're right. You did, you read a little bit more than I did. - I didn't read a damn thing. I'm just that fucking smart. (laughing) - Very nice. - What's ripple? Tell me about ripple. - Yeah, so I can't tell you a whole lot about it because I try, it is not the cryptocurrency that's been fluctuating in the up and down and the news to the last few days. Not to be confused with the cryptocurrency. No, this is from the good people over at Tinder. It's a, it's a, and actually I didn't tell you this, but I went to school with one of the co-founders there. So I'm gonna talk to him a whole lot, but he put this link out on Facebook and I saw it the other day and so I give him credit for the info 'cause that's how I found out about it. But yeah, it's a, it's a, you know, it's a Tinder-esque kind of application for social networking, professional networking. So think Twitter meets LinkedIn, not Twitter. I said Twitter a few times. Think Tinder meets LinkedIn, that's what Ripple is. So it's swipe left if you don't wanna meet up and swipe right if you want them and you're not working meet up, I don't know. It's like a, I haven't been able to try it because they released, I think they're in a hurry to get this out for CES and it's out on Google Play and had I downloaded it but it kept crashing. I couldn't get signed in. I wasn't able to network. I'd be, yeah, I'd be curious. And now the use case that seems a little bit of an odd concept, but who knows it probably works better than what I can envision. Maybe you should reach out to the guy and say, hey, come talk about this on the coffee coat cast. Yeah, maybe he's pretty, he's, he's pretty, he's got baller status, man. I don't know that he would have time to do that anymore. I mean, he was like on the ground floor, he was, he's one of the three or four guys that got, got that going. So, and he's still working for Tinder anyways as far as I know. like a separate app or does it integrate with your existing Tinder? No, no, it's a separate app. It's a spin-off from the company. So Tinder is owned by Match now, right? And so this is a match sponsored or match. It's behind the match brand. They actually put a team together to do this project. Because there's some of those where they have like three different kinds. There's like the the dating kind, the friend kind, and then there's like a group kind, and it's all rolled into one app. - Oh no, that's not the intent behind this. This is really just supposed to be a LinkedIn separate app, separate interface. Yeah, it'll be interesting. It's very, very early and new. Like I said, I couldn't even get it signed in. The OAuth, the two factor auth, it would get me there and then it would crash. So I don't know, we'll just have to look for an update and try again, but yeah, I'd be curious to see. What incidentally what I read though is that that was discussed even before Tinder took off the idea was that it wasn't just going to be about a dating thing. It was really going to be about social engagement on a more broad level. So how people interact and meet each other and so I thought that was interesting. I didn't know that fact either. And that's all I've got. I think I think I've talked enough about this. There's been some cool stuff coming out of CES. It's very early. This is the first day open to the public. We're going to have a lot more to talk about on feature episodes as more stuff comes out the next few days. So stay tuned for that. That'll be a little teaser for what's to come. What else are we going to tease out next time? We said that we're going to have another deep dive on what's happening with the processors. So yeah, I think that'll be a good good segment. A lot of people it's if we can, especially if we can distill it down to something that people can understand because it's a very technical thing. It's a hardware related to your item that people don't know a whole lot about. So I think if we can just still it down into some way to explain it that people don't understand. I think it'll be a good good thing for people to know. Also, go update your shit, update your machines, update your phones, update everything. Update all the things. Yeah, I've been hearing that a lot. Update. Set your iPhone. Why not update the iPhone? Because the slip's the slow down. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Don't update your iPhone. You want it to slow down? Did I I didn't tell you on glad you brought that up actually that was that should have been a show no That was another thing that I brought up in my Review of your guys last episode France is I actually has a lawsuit against Apple because planned obsolescence is against the law there Wow, and I mean I could be wrong on that one so I I call me crazy, but I think I already know who's gonna win that one, especially since it's something they already like Admitted to doing in our fighting public backlash with their battery replacement thing big time Yeah, it's gonna heat up. Well good thing Apple has Couple hundred billion in billions and billions of Yeah, they're they're they're getting it. They'll be okay. I'm not too worried about them On that note though, there was some good feedback I heard from on Facebook actually Some in the comments section on our cut our cast on episode number seven one of our one of our listeners there He had put out you gone to the Apple store to get a battery replacement and they said oh, yeah It'll be 29 bucks and come back in an hour. It'll be done And he came back in an hour and they said oh, you know, we couldn't actually replace your battery so we're gonna give you The same phone for 30 bucks Still charging the 29 but they gave him a replacement. I don't know what it was an iPhone 6 7 whatever was it was the same model same size I had heard that before so I thought that was interesting. I've had that experience before they're pretty good about that If you have a repair that maybe they can't get done in a you know reasonable amount of time or maybe I don't know if they don't have a Technician available or whatever the case may be They have a whole stock of of I think what they amount to is refurb bones You know so they'll give you a refurb instead of making use of their and wait so I've had that happened to me a couple times Certainly, I've heard of it on the warranty side, but I assumed it was out of warranty. I could be wrong about that, but that's nice. They're taking care of the people now anyway. That's good. So fine folks at Apple. Well, that brings us to the end of our show here. Is there anything else we want to talk about today? I think we kind of run out of time. Yeah. So reach out to us on social media. Let us know. Let us know what you think of Mr. Joseph - There's Bolly on the show here. - Do a self-flog on my Twitter. - Sure, why not? - It's at Rainbow Sparkle 420. - Let me check this shit out really quick. Make sure he's not kind of... - I'll send it to you right now. I'm not shitting. - I need you to follow me then too, 'cause I'm four followers away from 100. (laughing) - This is my Twitter handle. - Rainbow Sparkle 420. Is it like a pink background? - Yeah. - I think I have sloth dolphins. I'm so hilarious and I left my filter out the door. So forget, keep your panties on this. It's gonna get fun. That's not you. Who is this? This is somebody else that's rainbow sparkle for 20. - No, hold on, hold on. No, I'm serious, hold on. Let me-- - What is this, kind of? I think I just got a virus on my machine. - What's your Google? - No, no. - Yeah. - Oh, you haven't abbreviated. That's not sparkle spelled out. I did the full sparkle and I got something a little different. - No, it's SPRKL, dude. There was limitations on the size of user names back when I made that. Yeah. Well, he's honest. Sometimes I'm kind of funny, he says. Yeah, that's good. Yeah. I've got a picture pad on there. Got a couple of dogs. Yeah, look at those puppies. Look at those puppies, yeah. [laughs] Awesome. Well, I'm following you now. This is great. So you can follow Joseph Bowie at Rainbow, SPKL. SPRKL. - SP on our channel. - No, no, no. - PRKL 420 on Twitter. Follow 'em up. - Yeah. - Rate us on Facebook, rate us on all the services, rate us on wherever you can, soundcloud iTunes, Google Play, etc, etc, etc. Reach out to us, we'd love to hear from you. Email us. - We did get the URL working, www.coffeecodecast.com. - We did. - It is working now. - All the episodes are available on copycodecast.com. And listen to the more recent ones if you're a new subscriber because we've had a few people mention that They've listened to the first few which I think are pretty rough. So Hopefully you've made it to episode number 10 or any of the more recent one. I was gonna add a disclaimer But I I made I made that Twitter in middle school, so don't judge too hard. What like four years ago when the fuck was this? Oh my god March 2013 is when you joined you fucking it was four years ago Five year it'll almost five four and change. Yeah, that's why we got a probably got a fact check shit around here Because people try pulling this stuff on us all the time [Music] (gentle music) (gentle music) [Music] (upbeat music) [Music] (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [Music] (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [Music] (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [Music] [Music] (upbeat music) You guys both went to religious schools, right? I think so. (laughs) I mean, maybe they didn't practice real heavily, but they're both technically religious schools, right? - Yeah, I went to Pacific Lutheran University in Tacoma. You might have to cut this part out, but actually, all my application, I really didn't wanna go there. And so I put, they asked for what religion I was, and I put Satanist. And you got him. Well, we need diversity in our program. So let's bring him in. Yeah, I don't think I have only told like four or five people that I might heard someone about that Sorry, are you are you asking that we were kindly removed that from the record or? What did it's okay? Yeah, yeah I think he has no comment on that. I also wanted to use that at your discretion. Yeah, he's your own discretion on how my work colleagues or future jobs might take that. I guess, I don't know too much about. Oh boy. Well, it's already-- Mike and I already have 7 and 1/2 hours of bullshit out there that people can use against this. So you might as well have some. Yeah, we might have a little dirt on you. I mean, it's only fair. There we go. You can blackmail me with that. I don't, it's, I doubt your parents know about your baby yet either, right? No, they got a lot to tell them on this episode. Baby and fucking. Yeah. Well, I grew up in a Fox news, Fox propaganda household. Sorry. I don't, I don't like to use the term news because I feel like it's disingenuous to their cause. So having these such progressive ideas might come out as a shock to them. Well, Bolly, it's up to you to let them know that you're on this episode. So I can't speak to the contents of what's been posted on this show, but I can say you can decide whether or not you want to send that to them. Boom. I would imagine they follow Rainbow Sparkle, don't they? Nope. They don't know about that one. I think they know my email address is similar, but not the same. And I think they know about that one. Oh boy. Yeah. Oh boy. I think I have a separate, I haven't had the chance to tell you a story separately. Outside of work about um, so you know that and cut this out too. You know that picture of me on Facebook from Pride Week? I'm really glad we did the post show. This is turning out to be a great post show. Yeah, the picture of me on my Facebook from Pride Week after I posted that on Facebook and had my profile picture. I went to my mom's wedding and her and my aunt sat me down and were like, "Okay, Joseph, you know, we're accepting and if you have anything to tell us, you can go ahead and just say right now, just know we're going to love you no matter what." And I was like, I just looked at them straight in the eye. I was like, Mom, Antrenifer, I'm straight and I just took a picture, probably, I don't know what she guys were expecting. I did that with a straight face. That was pretty good. Well, I think it's good that you come out straight on the copy codecast here and make a public. I think that's a good thing. It's going to settle a lot of disputes out there, huh? Oh, boy. I should have not had this in recording. I told you, Bolly, I think I've told you, but I don't know if Mike was there when I told this story. Similar story. Of course, my roots are in the Midwest where everybody's pretty conservative, or generally speaking, are pretty conservative, although Iowa does sometimes flop on the liberal side. Anyway, I do a lot of photography, as you both know, and I did a photography job for a gay couple. And as I was posting a few of the photos on Facebook, there was one that was of the grooms and the groomsmen in this case. And I posted that up and I just posted something to be effective like, hey, look at all these gentleman looking really, really good or something like that. I don't remember what the exact words were. But my grandmother who is very, very conservative and very, very anti-gay liked that photo. I guess thinking that maybe it was just like the groomsmen party. I don't know exactly what she thought. I was just like, "Oh buddy, you have no idea what you're liking right here." Oh no. Hey, she might listen to this, who knows. She's a pretty big guru with the iPad these days, so maybe she listens to the show, although she probably wouldn't approve of all of our swearing, I would imagine. Well, for fuck's sake, Kyle. Can't win 'em off. Gosh darn it. Yeah. Dang it. Shoot, or don't you know, this Hecken Podcast. [Bell] [Music]